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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 7:34:04 GMT -5
Well, after the great flop that HEROINE was, maybe we should stay with MALE leads.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 11:45:19 GMT -5
Well, after the great flop that HEROINE was, maybe we should stay with MALE leads. never give up do you. Anyway, on the GAH project, the character in the suit is male. Doesn't mean that in the future, say if the series did pick up, the male wearer did hand it over to a female wearer. I'd just hope that the male role got a proper goodbye and the new wearer was anything but Holly.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 12:26:36 GMT -5
I don't know...there was really only ONE successful FEMALE superhero lead in my mind...and that was WONDER WOMAN. Others were tried and failed, so I think most people have the MALE mentality to superheroes. Even if Holly HAD been written well, I don't think she would have fared that well...probably still not today. ELEKTRA or whoever Jennifer Gardner played did not do well either, you know.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 12:47:24 GMT -5
True, and a lot of it had to do was of Linda Carter. She knew how to present herself well. Isis was another strong character (IMHO) just got caught in kitsch. Elecktra worked... but with Daredevil. Solo, I'll admit she didn't work well. But, like you've said elsewhere, if the female superhero isn't in an outfit that accentuates her assets properly, she's not really given a second look. And, given the way the suit is... that'd probably wouldn't happen either at least at the moment.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 13:58:30 GMT -5
It could have at the time, but with the established cast...as in Connie wearing it.
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Post by extreme01 on Aug 2, 2006 14:19:59 GMT -5
It wouldn't have happened anyway. She was too busy with "Hotel". would've been nicer than ditzy Holly.
Ted
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 14:24:48 GMT -5
I agree that it couldn't have happened at the time. However, that would have been the best bet...maybe even Rhonda...if she had not been busy. I think that they should have realized that Holly was a bad character and scrapped it until the reunion show. Or filmed the two-hour pilot, which might have been successful.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 16:15:46 GMT -5
I don't know, given the way Ralph loses the suit. Even with a progression of egoism, it was still contradictory to the original character. Holly might've worked with a better actress, but given some actresses at the time, I doubt it. With the way it was filmed, Kevin would've been a better choice and might've brought the series back. Only difference is that Ralph and Pam would've had to be there, which would've been good for the arguments, etc., couldn't happen because of the aforementioned unavailablilty of Katt and Sellecca.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 16:23:10 GMT -5
Kevin would still be too young in 1986 to be a part of that. I think HEROINE might have been successful even with Holly had the whole two hours been out there for us to see. I think it would have been best to have the greenguys think Ralph is getting an ego, similar to 200 MPH FASTBALL and that they decide to give the suit to Pam where she can be the hero and he can be back-up. That would have kept the same characters and allowed the loyal fans back to a somewhat familiar base. Too bad it could not have happened THAT way.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 16:43:05 GMT -5
Kevin would still be too young in 1986 to be a part of that. I think HEROINE might have been successful even with Holly had the whole two hours been out there for us to see. I think it would have been best to have the greenguys think Ralph is getting an ego, similar to 200 MPH FASTBALL and that they decide to give the suit to Pam where she can be the hero and he can be back-up. That would have kept the same characters and allowed the loyal fans back to a somewhat familiar base. Too bad it could not have happened THAT way. You know, I know of a certain story that has a suit handed down from Ralph to another family member and Ralph helps out as a second banana (Enter Aidan from "Ties That Fly..." Yes, I know she's not a real character as far as canon, but the idea has been used. ) And, Pam wearing the suit... "Ole Scenario Switcharoo" and Lauren's "California Nights."
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 16:53:15 GMT -5
Yes, but I mean using the HEROINE concept with Pam...I wonder if that would have worked had Connie been available and not Katt. I am using this thread now for actual canon characters that should have played other than Kevin.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 17:01:48 GMT -5
Only problem with it is what would've happened to Ralph? I don't think a majority of the fans would agree with them being divorced, as they were very much in love through the end of the series (even in "The One the Suit was Meant For." And, Ralph dying or being killed really would've set off a lot of people and could've hurt the show a lot.
IMO, he'd still have to be available to work with them as I've felt the combo of the two is why the Hinkleys worked even better than just Ralph solo and Bill. Katt was doing Perry Mason movies, so they'd had to schedule the episodes around that filming. He'd miss some episodes like Connie did as Pam after her pregnancy, but it still was possible.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Aug 2, 2006 17:03:40 GMT -5
I think he could have been focused more on teaching or something and that took him away from it...or something could happen where his mom got sick and had to be gone. I think most of the Bill and Pam scenes were fun and that would have made HEROINE that much better...include Katt some, but just about the same as they did Connie in HERO.
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Post by MelMac on Aug 2, 2006 21:44:40 GMT -5
Yeah, that'd work, and when Katt could, there were more eps. where he had more of a part, a lot like what happened with Connie. A Bill/Pam team would've worked as well had the circumstances worked out. And... probably would've at least made one season over Bill and Holly simply because there was a better chemistry between the original trio. More I think about it, they should've either a. waited until the original trio was available and brought it back or b. restarted it with a completely different team (no one from the original trio teamed up with the new suit wearer). (And, given the way Holly was played, Kevin, even at that age, would've been better in the suit. ( )
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Post by MelMac on Feb 4, 2008 10:48:59 GMT -5
More I think about this, it would be dicey for Kevin to wear the suit. It's possible, but we don't know enough about the character to really know for sure. The only thing we know is that he is sarcastic and ungrateful to Bill, but loves his dad, mom and Pam.
There are two ways you could go with this - have Kevin sarcastic and ungrateful about the suit, or reluctant like his dad and then realize it's important he wears it. Would be interesting to see a complete Kevin in the suit story to see the what-ifs there.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Feb 4, 2008 11:39:27 GMT -5
You forgot the possibility that he could be like his mother and that would make him like Beck.
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Post by Nicol on Feb 4, 2008 13:44:12 GMT -5
You forgot the possibility that he could be like his mother and that would make him like Beck. That is a good point. especially if it was his mom who raised him. and based on the one time we see her, it doesn't seem like she kept her opinions about Ralph to herself especially when in front of kevin. She seemed strongwilled and probly had a lot of influence on her son.
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Post by HoudiniDerek on Feb 4, 2008 13:45:47 GMT -5
I agree. Of course, hopefully the GG would not give it to him then since that should be looked at more closely now BECAUSE of Beck...but I don't think the sarcastic approach would work too well either....it could, but most people would expect a Ralph or Holly in the suit in my thinking.
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Post by MelMac on Feb 4, 2008 14:11:41 GMT -5
I agree. Of course, hopefully the GG would not give it to him then since that should be looked at more closely now BECAUSE of Beck...but I don't think the sarcastic approach would work too well either....it could, but most people would expect a Ralph or Holly in the suit in my thinking. I don't know, MyTatuo's story beginning was going fairly well IMHO, and would've been interesting to see what came out of it. I liked the sarcasm about the suit to begin with as far as he was concerned and such. I've done one where he was bitter and decided to estrange himself from Ralph, but it's more a what-if story than anything. But, his mom would have a lot of power in his upbringing, so I see your points there as well. Makes me wonder too if he ever became bitter to BOTH parents because he didn't see Ralph often because of custody and his mom probably when she was away shooting and he was with a nanny or at school. Would be interesting to look at too.
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Post by jdkikerx78 on Feb 4, 2008 18:40:52 GMT -5
The fan film I'm working on now was first based around Kevin. The idea was that he went to live with his mom as a kid, thinking his father only had time for Bill and Pam...not knowing what was really going on.
During his teen years, after a really nasty fight with Ralph, he was finally told the truth. This made him even more upset, because now he thinks that his father is nuts...so they don't speak for a few more years. Kevin ends up doing 2 years in the peace corp and gets visited by the green guys because of that. He realizes that his dad was telling the truth and wants to make peace with him...but Ralph/Pam/Bill had all been kidnapped by an old enemy, Gideons Army.
The rest of the movie had him partnering up with an ex, who was now a private investigator in her fathers company, and they of course save the day. Father and son make up and that would be the launch of a new series. In the end, I thought the premise was kind of weak and to hard to pull of as a fan film. There is just no way I could cast someone else as Ralph or Bill, and get away with it lol.
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