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Post by greenguy on Dec 10, 2022 13:53:51 GMT -5
Hey green guy Loved the analysis of fake and real insignias and costume. Do you know if there are official descriptions of the colors. Do you know the shade or red? There’s black (obviously) and is the background white or a light gray (hard for me to tell). Thank you for helping us fans. If it wasn’t for you one of us would’ve been out $23,000! Glad you liked the analysis of the fake and real insignias. I don't know the correct color of red that was used. I could probably figure it out if I took swatches with me and paid another visit to the suit. That is if the owner would be alright with that. My first thought is that the costume is 40 years old and has any fading happened over the last bunch of years? Probably not a lot if any considering the way its stored. Your're welcome Joe. I don't want to see anyone pay out their cash on anything fake from the series. Especially these fake suits that have been sold over and over as legit. I'm only aware of one owner of a fake suit selling it for what it was after it came to light it was not a real production used piece. I have no idea who bought it, and if it remains in their hands or if it's been sold again and misrepresented. Years ago I personally was in contact with three people at the same time that owned fakes. At the time they owned the suits, another appeared and was sold. That's four fakes that hit the marketplace. After that it starts to get confusing, because one was sold and I think resold after that. The original seller that produced the fakes had another for sale, but by that time it was getting around in collectors circles and it GAH fandom that fakes were out there. I have no idea if that one sold or not. Plus I was told the seller started using other means besides ebay to sell his garbage. Actually they aren't garbage, they are well made but you know what I mean. I'm sure the current auction won't be the last time a fake suit will appear for sale.
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Post by greenguy on Dec 10, 2022 15:27:34 GMT -5
is the background white or a light gray (hard for me to tell). Joe, I buzzed through my reply so fast I forgot to answer you about the white or gray. For the longest time (before DVDs, enhancing software, etc) I thought that the first season insignia was backed with white. Now I believe it's light gray like seasons 2 and 3. It is possible it might have been a lighter shade of gray than what was used on the other insignias. Check out this extreme close up from the pilot. I snagged this from the scene when Katt is looking at himself in the full length mirror. I blew it up and enhanced it a bit but not changing colors and not going to large to make it lose a ton of detail. Looks like light gray to me. You can see this same style insignia in the 2nd season episode Don't Mess Around With Jim and the gray comes across a lot more clear. You might notice around the edges of the insignia a bit of something sticking out, like tape. I believe this is Stitch Witchery, and I have a sketch of a prototype suit that has a hand written notation "stitch witchery" emblem on" I believe this is the edge of the Stitch Witchery peeking out from underneath the insignia. Maybe it slipped out as it was being applied, or maybe not cut as perfect as it should have been to stay hidden underneath. Later down the road the insignia was stitched right into the light gray material. These shots are from the images I'm starting to compile for that comparison of insignias that were used throughout the series run that you were asking about. It matters how much light and what angle its being thrown onto the suit to make it look more white, or light gray. I can tell you it doesn't take a whole lot of light thrown onto the not correct darker gray felt on my fake insignia to make it look white in a photo.
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Post by joe61478 on Dec 10, 2022 21:15:45 GMT -5
I just have to say thank you again. You have such amazing attention to detail. All merchandise for the show (shirts, etc…) all appear to have white backgrounds. It’s cool to know now it’s actually a light gray (and my tattoo will have a light gray thanks to you!). I really can’t wait to see the side by sides of all the insignias for the show that you’re working on!
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Post by joe61478 on Dec 10, 2022 21:16:13 GMT -5
Also I can’t wait to hear what your thoughts are on the Dorleac book!
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Post by greenguy on Dec 11, 2022 5:54:36 GMT -5
Glad to help Joe!
Yep, you are correct about the merchandise. It photographs for the most part as white, and I’m sure that’s why everything was/is made with white as the color. The choice is, do you want something screen accurate that may look wrong to people, or go with the way people recognize it from on TV? I don’t think in that respect either choice is wrong. It comes down to personal preference. Good luck with that, I hope it comes out nice.
I’ll let you know about the book, it’s on the way.
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Post by greenguy on Dec 11, 2022 6:17:06 GMT -5
Another bit of info I dug up about the suit currently on ebay. The seller is telling the truth about it being sold in a recent auction. The auction was just over a month ago, and sold for less than 3 grand. This seller may honesty believe it’s real, or maybe does not care one way or the other as long as he sells it. That’s my personal belief based on the items sold previously and currently up for auction. I’m sure anyone inquiring would be told all the items are legit as they come with a COA, COA’s are worthless. This is the same costume that was up for sale in 2003 and did not sell.
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Post by joe61478 on Dec 11, 2022 13:54:39 GMT -5
Very interesting. Makes you always question. What’s real and not real. It very well could be like you said that the seller believes it’s real. I guess asking for so much is his right but I can’t imagine anyone paying $23,000. It’s crazy how coa’s are worthless. It’s the bread and butter on “pawn stars” as they won’t buy the item or the value of the item increases significantly based on it. I’m surprised Dorleac hasn’t shown publicly the “true” costumes or how he made them. It would’ve been interesting to see it as a dvd extra or something like that.
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Post by greenguy on Dec 11, 2022 14:47:54 GMT -5
Very interesting. Makes you always question. What’s real and not real. It very well could be like you said that the seller believes it’s real. I guess asking for so much is his right but I can’t imagine anyone paying $23,000. It’s crazy how coa’s are worthless. It’s the bread and butter on “pawn stars” as they won’t buy the item or the value of the item increases significantly based on it. I’m surprised Dorleac hasn’t shown publicly the “true” costumes or how he made them. It would’ve been interesting to see it as a dvd extra or something like that. After paying the buyer’s premium in that auction the eBay seller has around $3,300 invested in the fake suit. No doubt the shipping was outrageous for that large heavy frame. I imagine there’s over 4K invested in it total. Sad to know someone spent that kinda of money for something not screen used. Like you said, he can attempt to sell it for whatever price, but 23K is outrageous and it wouldn’t be worth it if it WAS real. Who knows if Dorleac has any real costume pieces from the series. Does he say in the book that he still owns something? I know he does have a large collection of costumes he created, but I’ve never heard if that extends to anything GAH.
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Post by joe61478 on Dec 11, 2022 15:17:39 GMT -5
Hey green guy. I didn’t read Dorleac’s book cover to cover. I only skipped to the parts where tgah is discussed. I do not recall him ever discussing him still owning anything from the show (he may have but I didn’t see it). He talked about creating the suit and fitting Katt for it. Would’ve loved more detail as it’s only talked about in about 5 pages of the book. I can’t wait to hear your thoughts on it. He may autograph your copy as my copy was autographed.
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Post by justanotherskirt on Dec 12, 2022 8:38:55 GMT -5
I was discussing this costume over on the I Spy Forum and someone suggested that the seller should be reported for trying to sell a fake, and the listing taken down. I'm not wise in the ways of eBay, but I wouldn't want to get this guy in trouble if he believes it's an original. Should someone advise him that this is a reproduction and to list it accordingly?
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Post by greenguy on Dec 12, 2022 10:04:37 GMT -5
I was discussing this costume over on the I Spy Forum and someone suggested that the seller should be reported for trying to sell a fake, and the listing taken down. I'm not wise in the ways of eBay, but I wouldn't want to get this guy in trouble if he believes it's an original. Should someone advise him that this is a reproduction and to list it accordingly? In the past I have contacted sellers when they have been attempting to resell one of the fakes. It's never went well, I've been accused of lying or trying to pull some sort of scam and one claimed to have reported me to ebay for contacting him about it. Although I never heard anything from ebay about the matter. I'm not ruining my good standing ebay account over someone selling a fake. I suppose I could report it directly to ebay, but why would they believe me? I'm sure I can't spell out the whole wild yarn in 250 characters or less or whatever amount they allow in their message box currently. Judging by the other items up for sale, this person may just "invest" in this stuff hoping to resale it and maybe is not aware. He/she may see the COA and think "it's legit" The suit is not the only item I question, but it's the only item I have a background of experience with when it comes to the fakes that were sold. I'm glad the word is out on the I Spy forum, I wouldn't want to see any members there scammed either.
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Post by justanotherskirt on Dec 12, 2022 11:48:06 GMT -5
Well, I can understand that it would not do you any good to get involved on eBay. No one wants to admit they're selling fakes, and if this guy has invested so much in this, the last thing he would want to do is admit it's a reproduction. If he's really got over $4,000 in it, he's probably stuck.
I was so focused on the costume thing that I didn't realize at first that this thread had 3 pages! So Jean-Pierre Dorleac was the suit designer, how cool! He was also the costume designer for Quantum Leap, which must have been a real hoot, a costume designer's dream. AFAIK, Dean Stockwell was totally on-board with Al's flamboyant taste in clothing. And a good thing too.
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Post by greenguy on Dec 12, 2022 12:13:18 GMT -5
He's in that fake for a lot of scratch. I doubt even if he was told that he would sell it as a reproduction. As far as I know only one seller has done that. Dorleac's book was just left in my hands by the mail carrier. I'm a fan of many series he worked on, and yes from all accounts I've read Dean Stockwell was all for Al's wild outfits. The whole fake suit saga would be a good story to tell after one of TGAH Video Chat's if I start those again. I was thinking about maybe doing a all day every episode of the first season on March 18, 2023.
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Post by joe61478 on Dec 12, 2022 18:07:56 GMT -5
So glad you got Dorleac’s book green guy. Would love to see a video chat! Where are the older video chats? Are they still up?
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Post by greenguy on Dec 12, 2022 18:49:13 GMT -5
They aren’t available I didn’t screen record those. We watched one of my remastered into HD episodes live and talked about the show while it was playing.
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